ENFP vs. ENTP


#1

I want to get clearer on differentiating ENTPs from ENFPs, especially men.

For the ENTP example (provided by Blake), I watched Carl Sagan because I loved Cosmos:

For ENFP, I watched Stephen Colbert:

Based on these two videos, plus my own personal examples, here’s what I see:

-Ne seems more obvious in ENTP presentation than ENFP, perhaps because of Fe. However, when ENFP talks, more Ne is present than ENTP. (Not entirely sure why)
-Fe in ENTP is more “open” but also childlike than ENFP
-ENFP has undertone of slickness (Fe-id), while ENTP has undertone of impatience/restlessness (Te-id)
-ENTPs tend to have a silly/goofy/absurd sense of humor, whereas ENFPs are more about irony
-ENFPs don’t like it if you criticize their effectiveness (tertiary Te), especially if you use Ti to do it. ENTPs either welcome or at least can take this information via Ti. On the other hand, ENTPs are more vulnerable to negative emotions in present time (tertiary Fe) and cannot take Fi-criticisms at all, whereas ENFPs are more able to accept this.
-ENFPs tend to talk only about what they’re interested in. They can listen to what you’re interested in, but they won’t make any effort to actually understand the topic beyond what it means to you subjectively. (Similar to INFPs.) ENTPs on the other hand will engage intellectually with topics they’re not personally interested in.
-ENTPs really seek out Fe in INFJs. I’m less sure what ENFPs seek for in INFJs.
-Healthy ENFPs can help INFJs come to better terms with Fi, whereas healthy ENTPs can help INFJs develop Ti
-ENFPs in Ne-Te loop either try to bulldoze you with their Fi-moral convictions or are in a constant whirlwind at “productive” activity. ENTPs in Ne-Fe are jokers who want lots of attention and can become people pleasing in a childlike way (look at how clever I am!)

@Blake, @schlopadoo, and others, feel free to add on/disagree/etc.

Also, based on my observations, I think John Oliver is also ENTP:

More later…


#2

Wait, before we start, I wonder what’s @Blake’s call on Stephen Colbert. I think it was at first ENTP and then ENFP and then at some point in the comments section in a later article he went back to ENTP. But maybe I’m wrong.


#3

He thought ENTP first, then went to ENFP. It’s ENFP on the official Blake typing wiki, and I feel like he’s said ENFP a number of other times, although I can’t remember where at the moment.

I think what Blake said is that Colbert’s persona on “Colbert Report” is ENTP, but Colbert the person is actually ENFP. But yeah, I’ll let him speak for himself.


#4

Colbert is like the worst example in this debate between ENTP and ENFP because if he is an ENFP, he’s the closest ENFP to ENTP I’ve seen. Yeah, I’m still not sure except to say that I know damn well he’s not an INFP, which is how that debate started. I conceded to ENFP as a possibility after some people gave me some flak for the ENTP typing. It’s possible. So is ENTP. Colbert isn’t the best example.

Interestingly enough, I had been thinking about this difference between ENTP and ENFP recently and it came to me as thus:

The difference between ENTP and ENFP is ironic detachment vs. ironic enmeshment respectively.

Also, please note that I recognize two types of ENFP depending on whether they fall at point 3 or point 7 on the enneagram.

I only recognize ENTP as falling at point 7 on the enneagram.

So, for the ENxP that falls out point 7, it’s gonna be kinda challenging to separate their differences. They both have Ne dominance and Te and Fe, either as an id function or tertiary function.

Colbert, for example, could be an excellent example of an ENFP with bypassed auxiliary Fi, with hyperbolic Te (mocking), or he could just be an ENTP, which has little Fi to start with. I see, or thought I saw, Ti fluency in Colbert, but maybe it’s just Ne hyperactivity with jacked up Te.

I perceived Colbert to be funny because he was making fun of Te in this over-the-top way. Essentially, he was making fun of a right-wing-Te-to-the-max type. But, he seemed utterly detached, like truly detached from it. Perfect ironic detachment.

But, there is such a thing as a self-mocking ENFP I do believe. And these other self-mocking ENFPs are ENFPs to me and not ENTPs. The best example I can think of is Jason Schwartzman in the movie Rushmore. That’s an ENFP to me in massive Te tertiary mode. He goes to this prestigious prep school, is a member of every club possible to such an extent it’s ridiculous. He has no allegiance to anything other than doing what looks good and is popuar, but yet at the same time in a very hipster way of looking edgy and iconoclastic at the same time. And it becomes an issue of love that turns him all around. Gotta see that movie if you wanna grasp this self-mocking ENFP thing.

Hyper-irony. Enmeshment. Trying too hard. Being bound up in what you are mocking or snarking.

ENTP, on the other hand, has a genuine remove (exemptness) from what they, with little effort and sorta offhandedly, mock.

ENFP, because of the feeling function, always comes off to me as being more bound up in what they may lambast or ironize, so that they are essentially mocking themselves.

It’s almost best to look at ENTP as someone that’s not really here. They are not bound up in the human experience, which can be represented in toto by the feeling function.

So, ENTP has genuine remove.

ENFP, faux-remove.

And, as I’ve said somewhere else before, ENFPs are at their best when they are mocking themselves.

And on the opposite end of the spectrum, the holier-than-thou ENFPs are intolerable.

Rushmore is one of my favorite movies and very endearing in some way.


#5

Another way to put the difference:

ENTP = Innocent
ENFP = Jaded

ENTP seems to have a genuine pre quality to it, like they are before everything or anything occurred and as such whatever they do has this sorta genuine innocence and freshness to it. Think The Fool archetype from Tarot. The zero.

ENFP is quite the opposite. They feel like they know all-too-well how shit goes and they are jaded as a result of that knowledge.


#6

And yeah, The Cosmos was awesome. I say no one but ENTPs should be hosting and narrating space documentaries. No Neil Degrasse Tyson’s or Michio Kaku’s. Bah.


#7

Yeah, I can’t say Neil Degrass Tyson grabbed me in the same way. What type would you say he is?


#8

Ok this makes sense to me, and is something I have noticed (in retrospect).


#9

Non-transcendent.


#10

do you have any example of female ENTPs?


#11

Off the top of my head - Lisa Kudrow. Probaly find a lot of them in the physics world. I don’t see them too much, either as celebrities or in real life.

The last time I remember seeing an ENTP woman on screen was in watching a documentary called Cassette: A Documentary Mixtape. Here’s the only clip I find with her in it for a few brief seconds

Her name is Lily Rothman. Apparently, she is a senior editor at Time Magazine or something like that. As soon as I saw her on screen I was like “ENTP girl!”


#12

Can it be explained how Carl Sagan is an ENTP? I find Sagan fascinating and read “The Dragons of Eden” with great fervor and as an ENTP would love to claim him but for some reason that typing doesn’t ring true to me. I’ve seen him largely typed as ENTJ and I think I agree with that. He’s more definitive in his judgements than the typical ENTP and exudes a more “in control” persona than many ENTPs. It seems like he has a definitive view towards science and the world and wants to drive people toward that conception. I think there is a teeter point here however as ENTPs can be similar but will bend more than he does for the sake of argument. We’ll find a way to make our definitive worldview more plastic depending on the audience we want to engage but not plastic enough that the conceptions lose their integrity. We just want to experiment with another PoV while still adhering to objective and rational truth…if the countervailing view has any validity that is. As affable and relatable as Sagan is there’s still something a little too hard-nosed about him to qualify him as an ENTP.

Prove me wrong please.


Wiki: Typings By Blake
#13

You’re right. I don’t think he’s an ENTP upon further observation and reflection. I’d put him at INTJ.

Strikes me as a Ti-heavy INTJ. But, you’re right, he’s very controlled and definitive and that’s not traits of ENTP.

So, strike Sagan from the ENTP list!

Also, I saw a pull to Fi tertiary in the above Johnny Carson video. It was in reference to something Sagan said about Star Wars, aside from the obvious fact that it’s scientifically inaccurate (No shit). Something he said about one of the characters in Star Wars.

Thanks Christian! Good call.


#14

I think if I were more confident with my MBTI skills I would have said INTJ but I’m trusting seemingly informed internet users right now. I did just order Jung’s Psychological Types at your advisement. Looking forward to the read. Also, Sagan reminds me of my INTP dad with his precision of movements. ENTPs and ENTJs are too “raw nerve” so too speak. Just that mine is the “funny bone” nerve whereas ENTJs are the nerves at the tip of the dick.


#15

What? Who am I going to use for my ENTP model now? :stuck_out_tongue:

What about John Oliver?


#16

I do think John Oliver is ENTP… but would like Blake’s view too.

A video from his show: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJm8PeWkiEU

[Why isn’t the link showing up as a preview?]


#17

Eh, why don’t you use Courage the Cowardly Dog? Works for me in a pinch :wink:


#18

I don’t care about John Oliver.

Check out Rupert Sheldrake, the developer of the concept known as morphic resonance. I would suggest that he is a good example of an interesting ENTP that is not over-the-top in that caricatured hilarity way that I often play upon.

Personally, I think his ideas are gonna be part of what leads science into a new paradigm. He’s important.

Anyway, check him out. I think he’s a fair and tempered ENTP fellow. Not all ENTPs are cartoons or caricatures. It’s just that the ones that are make such good copy :grin:


#19

If we’re moving on to fictional characters, how about Shuri from Black Panther? I suspect the actress herself may be an ENTP, as her performance perfectly encapsulates the whimsical genius and sheer joi de vivre of a healthy ENTP:


#20

Will check out Rupert Sheldrake later, sounds interesting.
Sure he’s ENTP though? Again gives a Carl Sagan-ish air :thinking:
but you know better.

Cool. But just to clarify, when I asked for your view, I meant on his MBTI type, not him. :roll_eyes:
I like John Oliver. He usually picks interesting and a wide range of topics, not just science.