How id functions work?!


#1

so, i’ve been doing some studying in id functions.
i was always confused to what this really do in each types.
blake told me it’s a ‘negative’ function. or something of that sort.
so i’ve been observing people and got some clues!

so, i kinda call it, a 'hungry function’
especially for extraverts.
please correct me if i’m wrong. i’m VERY NEW to this id function thing. but i’m getting gist of it.

for ExFP, ( Fe-id)
they love to be around people.
like they crave the social interactions. and sometimes can be annoying because they’re too outgoing and bubbly?
it’s like they want attention in a selfish way.

ExTP (Te-id)
it’s like they all have underlying ‘dominance’. it’s this competitiveness that can be ‘unkind’.
they want to be the best. not a friendly competition, but total dominance. it’s really not that pretty.

ESxJ (Se-id)
they are obssessed with physical things. whether it is looks or material possession. shallow stuff.
they tend to judge people based on it. and they want to have the best.

ENxJ (Ne-id)
they tend to say ‘i’m gonna do this, i’m gonna do that’ and not do it. and it’s really annoying.
for example ‘i’m gonna buy this when i get paid, i’m gonna get this when i go there’

so… this is progress… let me know if i’m off or whatever.

the introverted id functions are harder.
because it’s not really expressed unless they feel very comfortable.
but this is what i gathered from their slight expressions.

ISxP (Si - id)
this one was actually the hardest to ‘define’.
when this function is at work, they are the quietest. this function is least likely to be expressed.
it’s like they fall into depression or some kind of dark thoughts when they do this.
i see it, but i can’t put it into words exactly yet.

IxFJ (Fi - id)
this function is the one of the most emotionally selfish function. it can get really annoying. (imo)
the ‘doorslam’ function. i’ve seen ISFJs do the same.
it’s like they have this ‘fuck you all!’ attitude and just care about themselves.
like they completely shut off Fe. and they go into full Fi negative.
i call this. ‘being moody’

IxTJ (Ti - id)
i personally don’t think this is so negative. but i guess they can be ‘lecturing’ with lots and lots of information.
i like Ti function so much. that even when it’s negative, it’s interesting!
but i think F types might be bothered by Ti-id. especially when things are getting emotional.
this is like a hungry function. all IxTJs i know loves/likes/good at studying.
like they actually don’t mind sitting on their ass long time.

INxP (Ni - id)
this one is a little confusing to me too.
this seems like a depressing/dark function also.
this is rarely expressed. just like Si-id. this is more like in their head type of function.
sometimes, very rarely, i’ve seen this function in action where they blame others for what happened to them.
i wonder if that’s what Ni-id looks like.

i have more!

@johnonymous
i’ve been thinking about how ignoring functions work!
since we both have Fi in 7th function, which is an ignoring function.
i think 7th and 8th are an ignoring function
i don’t know how you ignore Se. but maybe i can relate to how you ignore Fi.
it’s crazy how your wife’s two dominant functions are your two ignoring functions. hahaha
and vice-versa.

and i’ll add more to the id functions when i see them.

i think i learn mbti through SEeing. haha. get it?
but it’s true.


#2

speaking of id functions.

ESTx’s dom-id combo is what makes them similar

Te-dom with Se-id , and Se-dom with Te-id.

when i’m with ESTJ, we talk about how we made money, or how to be successful and stuff.
no theories, no brainstorming, just spitting facts and sharing information on what works.

we both like nice things. but Se-id values ‘logo’ and expensive stuff.
whereas i just like the way it looks.

it’s like status vs style

ENTx’s dom-id loop is funny.
Te-dom with Ne-id vs Ne-dom with Te-id.

it comes out when they argue. it’s like ‘i’m right’ vs ‘i’m right’

learning these combinations of things makes mbti more fun. and easier.


#3

I am just recovering from an infj Id moment. I was deep in an Ni moment, when suddenly my kid starts crying his head off which completely threw me off and forced me out of my head. After he calmed down I was completely done with everything. My wife tried to talk to me and cheer me up and I couldn’t do it. I felt bad that I didn’t want to talk but I just couldn’t. I was in a dark place mentally. It felt like there was no hope for anything…until my wife suggested I stay home well she took the kids to her in laws and suggested I join them later. I am starting to calm down and recharge now. I’m more hapoy knowing that my wife is starting to understand how I operate.

I am also interested in learning more about the id function as well as the other bottom 4 functions. My brother just took the Mbti test on multiple sites and kept getting enfp. I was certain he was esfj cause he has a very present Fe vibe and brings up memories a lot. I knew he was unhealthy regardless of type so I’m starting to see that he could be an unhealthy enfp…resulting in an ever present Fe id, being in the grip Si, and destroying himself through devilish Se. Curious to hear more thoughts on these shadow functions.


#4

Blaming others for inxp could be part of the id. Especially linked with gripping inferior. Our inferior grips are outward and hiddeous. Go with the flow go with the flow…then bam no more flow blame people.


#5

I was in the shower [flowing water/timelessness] where Ni seems to work great, and was thinking on door slams and Fi Id, and the idea of door slam seemed very punishing outward when I think it is just as much if not often way more, punishing inside. For our lack of competence/confidence which fucked the whole event up somehow, when we were trying and were misunderstood or misguided, or became too overwhelmed with the attempt or reality of relationships.
Whatever that event may be.

Sammy is not going to actually ‘door slam’ his people, nor am I, unless door slamming is just putting on my headphones and charging back up. But if you look at it like an emergency shutting down, and not a door slam, it might be easier to see that what is needed is some positive feedback. Some recognition of our attempts to do the people thing and integrate. Clue us into your perception of what we are doing right, or that we are handling situation with even a little finesse.

It is okay to tell us if we are stepping out of line, but we also need to hear/see that you want very much to work it out with us. Without your help, it can take us a really, really long time to figure out that we are just being human and are in fact wanted around regardless of mistakes [many self perceived] that can look like atomic bombs to us.
Also, we sound confident. In so many ways, we are not. I know I put on confident when I want someone else not to be worried. Does not mean I have my shit together.

The door slams all over the internet where we stop talking to people and shut them out? Some who feel they have been slighted, might want to take a good look at how they got themselves there, because it is rare, rare, rare that I would cut someone out/lock a door.

I am almost always open to someone re-approaching me with growth and understanding. Being blasted for having had enough of ‘not enough’, and considered selfish for calling it a fucking day, is not merited, methinks.

Your putting this forth, though it brought this on, did not come off in a bad way, it is just an all over the place thing. Your speaking of it allowed me to think over it again, and I see that our withdrawing like a hermit crab could be confusing and daunting, but coaxing with a bit of love and real intention of care can do wonders.

Try to think about when you tell the world, ‘Fuck you all’. What is it that provokes a reaction like this in you?
For me, it is 'I am verily fragile, a veritable butterfly and you have to be gentle with a butterfly. Breezes are good. Thrashing winds, not so good.
And moody means we are hashing out all sorts of shit and for your own sake, go do something else.


#6

I have seen the needed positive feedback with my family infj . It is like a helpless state she can’t crawl out of . Light hearted non-nosey Fe works. Good will.


#7

I understand infj id function very well.
I have never caused them to go id.
i don’t think I can even trigger it.
and they don’t trigger my id function either.
but I’ve always helped them out of their id.

just like, hey, I wanna buy you food, let’s go,
and sit them down, and let them talk, ask questions, and let them vent.

being around infj doesn’t trigger my id function either. because they never try to compete with me. rather praise and appreciate my qualities. and even if they accidently compete out of admiration, it never makes me wanna dominate them. It’s like, aww let me help you.

infj id function is easy to deal with for me.

ISFJ id is actually harder to deal with for me. Idk why.

i can talk out of INFJ in their Fi id.
But ISFJ id is… Idk i Just don’t really vibe with si users for some reason.
I feel like part of me is chipping away being with si.
it’s like one of the most controlling function.
more than Te for me.
Te I can convince.
Si I cannot convince. it’s nearly impossible.


#8

You forgot to answer this. If we are going off Ids, In your case would it be ‘I am going to fucking dominate you, make you piss your pants and crawl off to whimper’?
Hmmm. You are right. I don’t think I did provoke this Id in my ESTP friend at all, and did not see much of this side of him. I am going to have to really think about when I might have seen it, under what circumstances.


#9

Interesting topic.

ISTP Id is expressed by them worrying they missed some detail somewhere. At work, they can obssessively go over and over something, often missing the big picture by getting caught up on worrying they missed a detail.

I don’t know how ENXj Id is expressed, but I suspect you are wrong on that. The promising and not delivering is more Ne dominant than Ne id. Typical of ENXP, not ENXJ. I don’t know what Ne Id looks like.

I think ENTPs are scarier than ENTJs because of Te Id.

My Id (infj) strongly comes out in relationships where I need to be the emotional priority. The thing that matters the most or has the most value to that person.

The Id is essentially the underlying childish motivation in each person that is expressed or governed through their dominant function. My guess is that ENXJs look for all the possibilities to use something to get to the top? This would make ENFJs quite formidable romantically. Versus ENTPs who want to dominate but see many different ways of doing it and possibilities for doing it (many which are not obvious to the world–which is the scary part–clown dominant to quote Blake). But they don’t actively use Se so they aren’t as scary to the world.


#10

I think Ne id might be like a constant hunger… Blake used the word hunger for enfj somewhere.
Entjs and enfjs, if you look at them, often have a restless energy.


#11

hmmm. i think you are right on point hahaha

i hate competition, i hate the idea of it. i hate the idea of someone losing.
but, if i were to compete, then what you said is how i feel.
" ‘I am going to fucking dominate you, make you piss your pants and crawl off to whimper’".
like you said.
that’s pretty accurate. how did you do it?

an example, is when i was super pissed, i was a teenager,
when i was ‘fist fighting’ someone, it wasn’t a ‘fight’, it was just me beating the hell out of the kid until he starts crying for help.
i wasn’t a bully. he started the whole thing, and he even threw the first punch.

and i always tell people when i talk about fighting
"i don’t like to knock anyone out, i want them to be fully conscience and feel every pain on their body. they can block my punches if they want, i will break their shield. i will punch their block so hard they wouldn’t want to block, they have to run away. or beg for mercy."

but i’m old now. so i can’t do that. or i’ll be locked up. and it’s stupid. hahah

now, i want to destroy someone mentally and make them cry. if they push to my id. but it rarely happens.

when does this occur? hmmm, i think they have to try to step on my pride.
disrespect. that’s what ticks me off.

i don’t believe ‘walking away’ is a strong act. act of strength. whatever you call it. i think only punks walk away.
if someone starts with me, i want to see the end of it.

i hate drunk people the most. drunk people piss me off. it’s impossible trying to reason with them.
i’m still learning to walk away from drunk people. i hate running into them. they always start shit.
recently i wanted to really hurt someone, and they were both drunk.
it’s so crazy how being drunk can make someone so courageous. or, fearless. or just completely stupid.

i just can’t walk away from drunk people when they start shit with me.
i would feel weak if i walk away. i’d rather feel stupid yelling at them, than to feel weak walking away.
i’d much rather pick being crazy and stupid over being weak.

i’ve seen so many INFJs walk away from trouble. and i admire that so much.
but they are made differently. different makeup. i wish i can do it. i just can’t.
the last time i ‘walked away’, i hospitalized the person a few months later.
it’s better to release than to blow up later.


#12

This what I think for each while i am very sleepy:
The id function is primal and often seen as negative and embarrassing but a part of ourselves we can’t help. All we can do is try to control and vent it in healthier ways or even try to hide it, but the more we hide it, the more it probably comes out in stupid/disastrous ways.
So this is the negative manifestations mostly, but you can always put a positive spin on them. One person’s eternal grudge can be another’s unshakable loyalty!

ExFP, ( Fe-id)
social neediness or clinginess that seeks validation from others
needing to be “petted” and be seen as “good” or “cool” or some kind of “virtuous”. needed to be needed or at least “invited” (even if they are gonna turn the invitation down lol)
can come off as overly whiny or self-congratulatory

ExTP (Te-id)
this is a winning-at-all-costs kind of function, where they will try to finagle a way into and out of situations to show that they can (often tied to vanity?)
often looks like power plays and competitiveness and underhanded strategies to get their way, bulldozing over people
usually will try to interpret even losses as “wins” in some 5th dimensional chess way, but to many outsiders it can look delusional

ESxJ (Se-id)
probably some kind of overindulgence or excess, especially with symbols of status or power like money or fancy foods or even sex
i am thinking there is an overall physicality to it too, like a throwing of one’s weight around, boulder-like
they probably come off like they take up too much room, too much air, always trying to consume or expand their presence in a physical way

ENxJ (Ne-id)
this is a wanderlust compulsion, there is an emptiness inside that becomes a vacuum for bringing things to them, looking like insatiable hunger, never wanting to settle, always thinking of multiple projects or goals to work on, the next big thing
they also don’t like being boxed in because they have a drive to be spontaneous and unpredictable, but maybe that just makes them all the more predictable

ISxP (Si - id)
this looks like rumination to me. thinking about the past and also their personal belongings’ past probably
little details stick to their memory or values, whether good or bad, and it can look like a crutch they use to justify their pain or unproductive behaviour. prone to beating dead horses, holding grudges forever, eternal chip on shoulder
can also look like neuroses about their stuff/information being touched/moved/taken/lost.

IxFJ (Fi - id)
i think this is easily understood as just overwhelming primal emotions, almost animalistic it its simplicity sometimes as rage or anxiety or sadness or glee to at max volumes.
this throws the person into disarray where they try to shut down to not leak out the emotions (growing cold or irate), or they may vent them in very unproductive or anti-social ways (Fi-id subjugating Fe to do its bidding often turns into social warfare and tearing people down)

IxTJ (Ti - id)
this looks at the world as a bunch of data or bits of ideas. an ultimate dissection of everything that is real into quantifiable bits and bytes. it often leads to information hoarding and drowning. rules, stats, data.
All the info needs to be read and absorbed and categorized, which can become an arduous and surprisingly useless task? also can be fairly pedantic/precise to an unproductive level.

INxP (Ni - id)
i think this often comes to them as clues or signals about a “truth” that can be red herrings or big revelations–just that it’s hard to tell–and it can lead them chasing down the wrong rabbit hole. It inserts a seed of paranoia looking for an easy way out or simple explanation.
there’s a kind of esoteric feeling with ni-id so it might be just plain creepy or unsettling to be in that state. Not so much a moral wrongness, but a deep existential wrongness as if they saw an abomination meant to never be revealed.


#13

yay! this gives me some confidence in my Se that I was pretty on point with seeing some of these id functions!

yeah. @Impossibletobe
I guess I meant to say that ENXJ likes to indulge on planning or hungry for the next big thing like Prax said.
I just hear them say “I’m gonna get this new phone, I’m gonna do this new project,” a lot.
I guess it’s only certain ones that forget their own prophecy and I’m just like 'so, when are you gonna do it?'
but you’re right about Ne Dom Not following through.
I guess Ne id usually follows through with it.
but since Ne is so many things, they just don’t follow through with everything whether it is Dom or id.

ni id is still confusing even after Prax explained it kinda.
but I guess the wrong rabbit hole makes sense for infp but I wouldn’t say so much for intp.
any example for this?
I just know that inxp sometimes blame something or someone using ni.
like it gets all dark and heavy.
and mostly they’re right about the blame they make.


#14

Hmmm.

I think Ni id kind of really gets into that aspect of Ni where Ni cannot be appreciated.

Ni id every now and then says something true. I agree because I’ve seen it in my husband when he tells me what’s wrong with me. It can be a bit wow. Like oh, shit.

But really more often Ni id is like, even if it is beyond right or wrong, it’s quite tainted nontheless…it’s not free perception. You have been hit with truths over time which you have mistrusted and refused to dissect. It’s been constant yet unproductive mental drain. So your perception is worn out.
These “truths” have lived in the back of your mind, unloved and spidery. They are compelling initially only to be rejected in disgrace. In an Ni id “blaming on others”…all these dust bunnies fall out. It is painful because they represent proof of your constant doomed engagements in being perceptive, your constant attention, but no one can understand what these dust bunnies represent ( … the word bunny is back :scream:) There is a huge longing to let this inner truth (s)/dust collections see the light…

Guess that is why if you pull up and out of the id…you clear things up for free perception again. But if you satisfy perception longings, you will build the spider webs again.

When Ni dominants talk about their mental maps… wow it’s so interesting…even though I know it’s again a metaphor used to describe something with no words. There is no map in Ni id. Maps are to navigate travel. But Ni id is not travel. It’s lodged in an underground room that you can’t exit.


#15

I feel you missed two aspects.

My ENFP brother has a very destructive need for external validation, which he hides usually quite well, but it drives all of his behaviour. This is a form of Fe, the need for social validation and conforming to get it. As an id, it leads to potentially destructive conformity, depending on the people around. He also has a lack of ability to produce his own self-validation (which I’ve seen an ENTP grows into this ability of self-validation over time)

My ENTP pet-- oops, I mean spouse-- ( :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: ) has a fervour overtake him of NEEDING to get things done all of a sudden; he becomes an engine that just runs with no end. Another piece to this is him freaking out over what he perceives as a lack of accomplishment. He fears stagnancy, and has a need to see physical expression of achievement in order to stave off anxiety. Sometimes this manifests as a sudden need to rearrange the house, sometimes as manic and uncharacteristic planning, and sometimes if Te impulse is not satisfied it manifests with Fi depressive PoLR, and the need to jump ship, run away and be a hermit. Usually his Te need to do, do, do can be alleviated with a reminder of what has been accomplished thus far, especially when it’s not physical.

Had anyone else been able to observe this behaviour in their pets-- I mean-- ENTPs?

Not sure if this is id expression, but my ENTJ father seems to have a sort of paranoia with everyone else trying to manipulate him in a psychopathic way. A victim mentality with the world conspiring to make him miserable. Is this an Ne doom and gloom what could go wrong?


#16

The paranoia that people are out to get him sounds a bit like Trump. (Trump being an extreme case)


#17

hahaha why do you refer ENTP as a pet?

what type are you? you must be pretty good at controlling ENTPs.

sounds like Ne. i associate paranoia as Ne.

when INFJ and INTJ use their Ne, the 5th function,
it comes off as an ‘controlled paranoia’

when ENTP and ENFP use Ne, it’s like overthinking. ongoing paranoia? but not really?

i guess Ne-id is victimized paranoia. i like your example. you may be right,
i don’t think i’ve seen that side of ENxJs yet. it must be very rare


#18

Hmm I did witness paranoia in an enfj. I asked her a question that was uncomfortable but had to be asked. Still reasonable since we were potentially going to hire her. She got very suspicious that I had a source for this question “I’m wondering where this is coming from”. She phoned a few days to ask again. And talk away the worry. I think she might have still been wondering afterwards who had spoken to us. No one had. I’m not sure if that is typical of enfj it not but the use of Fe to proactively manage the situation seemed so. In fact both enfj and entj seem very good at this proactive preemptive stuff.


#19

No, no one can control an ENTP. Those guys are like cats: sassy, independent, but so gooey on the inside. Tell them not to knock that vase off the nightstand and they will test how serious you are, and it goes crashing. The only time an ENTP pet can be sort of influenced is with the promise of food. :slight_smile:

But nonetheless ENTPs make fantastic pets-- I mean partners. :slight_smile:

I say pet purely out of irony, they’re the furthest type from a pet; I don’t know if it’s possible to subverse an ENTP lol.

What type do you think I am? :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:


#20

Interesting about the ENFJ, maybe we’re onto something here!

I don’t think Trump is an ENTJ. Not at all. I don’t yet have evidence, but perhaps I’ll watch some videos and do an analysis :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: he is very polarized (Fi negatively expressed) and focused on image, dominance, and VERY in the moment rather than future oriented as an NJ would be, more Se in Trump. I would not say much Si expression, and zero Fe in the group harmony sense. Ne presence I’m not at all sure on, I need to actually pay attention to him!

I would say he is not any of these:
E-FP, -N-J, IS-J, --FJ (No Fe id, no Ni focus, no adherence to social norms and exhibits risky behaviour plus shows too much Se for ISJ, and no Fe, respectively)

Which would leave us with INFP (unlikely but possible), -NTP (unlikely, or he would at least consider opposition perspective), ISFP (high Se id and polarizing Fi), -STP, ESTJ

I personally think ISFP or ESTJ are better fits for him, but I would need to watch him talk more :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye: what do you guys think?