INFP Id: Ni - roars and arrows


INFP have an Ni id, while Ne is their auxiliary function.
Ni itself is sometimes hard to explain because of its existentialist-yet-outside-of-time-space nature. But having it as an id function makes it even harder to view and explain directly.
Blake characterizes INFP’s Ni id as Leo on the forefront or top level, and Sagittarius on the bottom level, meaning that the Leonine version of Ni-id is often more “useful” or positive in some way, while the Sagittarian version of Ni-id causes issues.

Some related articles for reference:

So let’s flesh out what having an Ni-id means for INFP!

I am going to export posts from another thread that got deep into the topic to get the discussion going!

Relationships - Love - Sex

so let me ask…do you feel real?


Hahaha… sometimes I feel too real… like dragging body weighed down by the crushing apathy of the world and my useless feelings that I consciously turn into non-feelings to be able to deal with this damned existence…

Sometimes I feel eternal and intangible… especially when I’m reading or experiencing art/music/nature… I feel like everyone all at once…

I think there is a clear distinction between body and soul for me… my body doesn’t really matter… it’s just a container… and I need to do these things to keep the container together… but the soul I am very aware of… it feels very real to me… I even feel not feeling… I don’t know how to explain it to you… I think I’ve been switched off for a while now… more than a year… and I’m acutely aware of the fact that I’m switched off…


Gonna be “thinking” about that rest of day most likely. Thank u. Like time for paper and pen.


Does not feeling make you feel any less real? Do you feel like not feeling makes you function less well in some areas or is this benefitting you even if it is somehow feeling like absence of something. Like is it cutting you off from a source you need or not?
I am going through something similar but maybe not tied to being functional and don’t really know what to make of it. It was bothering me but now it seems like maybe this is just gonna stay like this and maybe it is okay. I can’t tell. I tried to fix it, a lot of feeling happened, then the state returned. Maybe it really is just necessary. I am not alarmed about it and it is kind of like how you said. One can feel even numbness. I always think of it as dissociation.


Hi Piggie, I think I can imagine what you wrote, how you can turn to art etc. and it is safer. Feelings arising in you are too visceral. But in art you find beautiful timeless distillations of these viscerally based human experiences.
I don’t know if it was a choice to not feel. Not sure if it is exactly like your friend since she is also saying she missed you.
I sometimes wonder if this level of feeling I now have is some other types’s “normal”, but it feels strange. Like being purely stoic. And without a means to gage things. I used to gage via feeling. I am amazed your friend shared this with you. I can’t imagine sharing stuff like this except on Stellar Maze. But you know like idealism? I read so many descriptions of infps as burning spirits or something. Not me. I have more indifference than care. Or good at love. Not me. But it might not be a negative thing. If this is gonna be like that I want to assume it is a positive growth.
You can delete. Thank you so much for sharing.


Is it possible to switch one’s dominant/id function off? I’m wondering now… like is it actually possible… so according to Blake, our id is our hardware… you can’t switch off hardware… you wouldn’t exist if there were no circuit with power flowing through it… and if the dominant is our operating system, we can’t turn that off without becoming unconscious either… so what does it really mean when I say I switch off… am I actually turning a function off or am I just choosing to ignore what it’s doing to me? Ahhhh… mind fuck…

I find you an inclined to Ni/Ne type of infp more than the inclined to Fi type…

What is the difference between using and not using Fi to calibrate experience? What does that feel like? (I’m sorry, I know it’s not easy to put this in words)…


I wondered about that for you. I thought maybe you can turn it down, but can you turn it on? Maybe it’s more like putting walls around so it hopefully won’t turn “up”, or can you literally turn it on? In the hardware analogy, turning the id off doesn’t exist just handing the reigns over to the dominant.

For me tuning Fi way down… it just feels disorienting…but Fi shouldn’t be really on too strong. It literally is not a good way to operate<–messed up dominant function. But no you can’t turn Fi off at all probably which is sort of confusing I agree…Maybe Fi is squeezed away kind of. Squeezed away until you become a stoic. But without being exactly the same as a rock<----but not that different. I am more and more like a rock. I feel colder and colder. Although feelings also bother me, nag me. Like unmet longings etc. But where I would normally be having feelings in the past, I often have none now, or they are less processed more irritated. Squeezed out maybe?
My only refuge away from being a rock is Ne. And Ne is unfeeling in some ways, feeling in other ways (in a cosmic sort of way, energy). But it isn’t exactly the same.
Interesting about conscious/unconscious. Woah. Because it does feel like when there are no feelings, everything is a strange dream…Fi truly gages with feeling. Yes. Very good point. You are so incisive.
Difference is Fi can explore feelings, somewhat, process them. But if you don’t want or can’t feel, then you also don’t “operate”. You are ghosting around. It feels empty. And that is really a strange feeling (for infp).


Yeah… like a dormant volcano? Hehe… that’s the image I get… sometimes it bubbles close to the surface… trembling lips… red ears… but there’s no processing… I just wait for it to cool off… I think it’s like turning a tap off instead of pouring myself into something (someone)…

Is it possible for you to do this with Ni? Can perceiving functions be controlled/ignored like that?

Yeah turning Fi operating system way up in this world is inviting isolation…

Do you think this can be reversed? Sometimes I think this is just not the right time for infx to exist…


The actual reality starts to feel like science fiction… (at least for me).


I don’t really know what perceiving function as “operating” system even means… lol. So I don’t know. Oh yes, Se minimums. That does it. Literally when you burn a muscle you don’t think about this stuff.


I’m having trouble picturing it too… need a sample human (can’t believe I said that)… yess… my mom… need to pay more attention…

Se is such a wonderful thing… I like Se minimums too, although I don’t need them :stuck_out_tongue:


I dont say it out loud but I sure do think it. The more real life samples I have, the more clicks into place I get.


Maybe I got all the words wrong. Maybe it is Fi that makes one be stoic and harder. Maybe it is using Fi that keeps one chained in weird ways. And to do what Fi says you have to turn off feelings? And that is disorienting. Argh. Words. Useless. A is B.



Yeah… it’s the only way to get the vibe down… words don’t capture as much… :stuck_out_tongue:


I think you might be right about the Si minimum… that collateral thing… I’ve seen that in my enfj friend and I believe it would’ve saved her a lot of trouble to practice Si minimum at critical junctures in life… Si minimum probably also includes biting off as much as you can chew and no more… they let their vision of perfection take over sometimes and get into frantic states of anxiety over not having everything exactly the way they want it… maybe it would help to focus on a couple of “most important things” and then go from there…

Ni minimum I still have trouble picturing… my mom has the weirdest use of Ni… it’s more like unwarranted suspicion, bordering on paranoia… it just pushes her to overdo Si… for eg. she’s obsessed with cleanliness because she imagines all kinds of creepy crawlies have made their way over the kitchen counter (not true)… I don’t even know if that is Ni or Si or a combination of both :stuck_out_tongue:

And… was thinking a little more about the switch… so… maybe… I don’t switch off as much as I switch from deep id to normal id… what I was describing as my unlocked state is probably Pisces id… because even when I’m ‘switched off’ I sure as hell feel those Scorpio style jabs of shame/self-defensive resentment…

@TinyYellowTree do you notice the difference in the flavours of Pisces id and Scorpio id?


Yikes! I’m so sorry! I didn’t realise I was making such negative broad generalisations :frowning:

And yes you’re right about distress/isolation being caused by not playing with the extraverted functions… I try to consciously work on these when I find the time… was good till I got swamped by job related work… I guess I’m just frustrated with my job right now and that makes me feel like I can’t do anything meaningful in life… But I am a long-term optimist… I believe it’ll all be worth it some day… And I do think Ni and Fi are essential for any genuine growth to take place in the world… It’s just that where I’m at right now, Fi is frowned upon… Ni, they like to use and abuse without understanding it’s true potential… sigh… hope I didn’t trigger too unsavory a feeling!


And it feels like not feeling when you are in scorpio pisces? This makes sense and kind of matches what Blake says about how scorpio is more functional. I don’t think I am able to observe my deep versus normative ids lol. Leo versus Sagittarius…or even observe it period. But eventually would like to.

I still wonder if this theory is really suppose to hold equally for all types. It works great for infj and intj.


Yeah it’s like having safe feelings… kinda negative, but tethered…

Hmm I get how strange/freaky Ni id is… but I can’t picture what is better and worse with respect to that… so your deep id is Sagittarius… what are the negative traits of Sag without a leash? Hmm… gonna think about it…


lol, normative id must be like nutcase and then deep id must be like ?even more? ?less so? nutcase. so infp is bag of nuts. added later: i now recalled that blake says normative id is like princess mythology and if you look at Leo sign you can tie it in to this sense of worth and dignity… (which is hard for me to acknowledge or see in myself, but it must be so). then i don’t know if the descent into sagittarius is for that to evaporate and truly feel abandoned into the void. or some other way around or whatever. almost impossible for me to see. especially leo. i prefer denial lol.


So Scorpio and Pisces are both you. Which feels "more " you?


What up with the sex thread heading just into ni-id talk? haha

I think Leo ni id can be inspirational. Gives you hints at something “great” or a gut instinct almost of a “somethig more”? You can use it to explore bigger ideas (often comes out in some sort of creative endeavour if you use Ne and Fi to make it into something). Maybe Sagittarius-ni id is more wild goose-chase. Chasing stray “arrows of truth” into mazes and getting completely lost. Hard for Ne to help at that point because it only scatters you further into the maze maybe?

To bring it back to topic slightly, maybe this is why it’s hard sometimes for you to think specifically about some topics, like “what is love” because it gets laced with sagittarian ni looking for deep truth and gets you lost. Leonine ni is perhaps more focused on something being awe-inspiring or shiny? Haha, hard to really grasp for me, but maybe it is a more useful mode for you and allows you to use it in a positive manner. Has more “foundation” to launch into Ne from. So maybe tweaking the ni focus from “does love exist even??” => “wow love is mysterious!” makes it work better for you.