Is Christine and The Queens an ENFJ?


#1

I’m blown away by this woman. Could she be ENFJ?


ENFJ Woman = The Bad Witch, The Villain, or the Temptress
#2

I enjoy her! Watched more.


#3

She is mesmerizing! I spent yesteday afternoon watching her videos and interviews. I rarely have such an impulse. I don’t particularly like pop music, but there is something truly original about her. She is totally out there AND commercial.


#4

I know what you mean, I heard her for the first time performing Tilted live on chat show and had to shush the room so I could zone in on her.

Initial impression, she seems softer than ENFJ (characterised by Blakes continuum)…less of a ‘don’t look at me but do’ vibe. It’s more like a… listen to me; open you’re eyes, look around. Reluctant to say anything but an INFJ quality comes to mind. Could just be Astro clothing though.


#5

Her performances seem ENFJ, but in that interview she comes off more INFJ. More tert Ti than tert Se.


#6

Ok, I take it back actually. I think she’s ENFJ, and the more introverted quality in her interviews is projected Ni.


#7

May I add INTP to the mix? The performances are something different, but watching her interviews I see a smart, cool, goofy xxTP woman. Funny, but not sexual. There’s this recent interview (sorry it’s in French, but body language is quite revealing here): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWI8uj9VVl0


#8

Oo that is different to the other interview. A more fun and flirty side. Need to watch some more.


#9

Interesting! I can see that as a possiblity. Maybe I was right about seeing Ti the first time then.


#10

Hi @nur – can you elaborate on this? I’m afraid I don’t see INTP, but I’m not well-versed in that type.


#11

If only I could…

It’s very frustrating to see something and not be able to explain it or even point someone in that direction, really. I often wonder what I’ve really gained from MBTI if I can’t even describe any given type at a very basic level for someone who didn’t know anything about all this. I’ve naturally gathered some visual and emotional data (How do they make me feel? How do I react to them?) for most of the types I’ve come in contact with and then just kept on reassigning them into these 16 boxes. Sometimes there’s a storm and they get all mixed up again. And then they don’t. Sometimes it works. I don’t have the words. (I could very well try to do it, but this feels fake to me. Like I might just as well try to make a case for any other X type and come up with a list of reasons why. But that’s not what made me think INTP. I thought INTP because I saw INTP).

I’m veeery enthusiastic about typing. It’s fun and exciting! I tend to get impatient. There’s a risk of being lazy and wanting to have the answer right away. Then I get it all wrong. But we can start it all over again. It’s fun! :upside_down_face:

Even though I can sometimes feel very strongly about my interpretation, it’s safer to take my comment as a bottle sent out to sea. Like: ‘Hey, would you take on this perspective and see where that brings you? (Could you take YOUR type knowledge and apply it to this thing I see and cannot explain and then help me make sense of it? Does it make sense to you?)’


#12

Oh my goodness. I feel the same way. :kissing_heart::heart::heart::heart:

I’ve been obsessed with typing for a few years and I still suck at it.


#13

@air @TinyYellowTree @nirdre @nur
ISFP has been thrown into the ring by a backer keeping in the shadows. Seems like strong contender after doing some digging around the maze archives. Thoughts?


#14

Oh, I like ISFP! Extraverted sensing in ze aux.

I laughed out loud at “backer keeping in the shadows.”


#15

Curiously, ISTP was the first impression I had. Often a type just pops into my mind, not to say it is correct, but there is the feeling, I’m feeling somethings. What? So, perhaps we are agreeing on tentatively considering perceiver? And I think there is a likelihood of Introvert. But I need to watch more of her, more interviews before I consider any sort of argument for anything.
I also considered INTP. It is hard not to compare people you know. My daughter would die, as she would say if she had to dance on stage.
Had not considered ISFP but I will let that roll around in my brain. The way she looks at the audience in the one interview and smiles reminds me of a man I think is an ISFP, so that is not like solid evidence, lol, but it did catch my attention. Her attention/awareness and dancing makes me think Se.
@Nur, I so relate to your typing comment. The storm where everything gets mixed up, yeah! I try to type most people I meet, silently of course. And more and more I am trying to be patient and realize that we all have the same functions and are going to see some form of them in everyone to varying degrees and it is really hard to remember how each behaves in each place, and then add who was your influence and how adept are people at different functions because of work or whatever… and this makes it too tricky to jump to conclusions. Course, that is kinda what happens either way… but these feelings my not be exact type but flavor? So to speak.


#16

#17

This is what I see in the French interview. Note that I don’t understand any French though.

Ne - goofy body language, seemingly scattered thoughts (in the way that she speaks)
Fe- open expressions, very smiley
Ti- sharp, penetrating gaze, there’s also a sharpness to how she talks (it’s all over the place, but there’s an edge)

Based on that video alone, I could believe INTP. In her English interviews though, I don’t see so much Ne, although it wouldn’t be as obvious all the time with INTP. I definitely think the Fe and Ti is still present. So def not ISFP in my opinion. Also, while her dance style is striking, I don’t get a striking Se presence from her in the persons the way I do from people with stronger Se. So not ISTP or ENFJ either. There is something stiff about her. Didn’t she also say she used to be painfully shy in one of her videos?

Yeah, the more I watch her, the more I think she’s doesn’t present as softly as an INFJ would. The androgyny thing would also go with INTP. @Nur I think I agree with you at the moment.


#18

@air: But we’re still here, aren’t we? So let’s just enjoy the ride. :hugs:

@sacha: Uhm, hard to see ISFP for her… I don’t see Fi and I relate to her via Ne. I don’t see Se either. At some point during the interview I linked she is asked what she would choose to perform if she only had two options: ‘Single ladies’ by Beyoncé and ‘Thriller’ by MJ. She says she doesn’t have that “Beyoncé-sque” quality (2:30) at all, so she’d pick M. Jackson, but it would be a disaster and she’d look like a chicken anyway haha.

On a different note, I love ISFPs and I think they are very underrated. Sometimes I get them confused with ENFJs. And some other times, I wonder if some of those supposedly E3 ENFJs might actually be ISFPs? Grimes comes to mind. I don’t know. What do they all have in common? I wonder how enneagram types and instinctual variants come into play. Would an sx be more ENFJ-like? This is how I imagine it. What do you all think?

@TinyYellowTree: Yes to influences and ‘how adept are people at different functions’! And flavors! It’s amazing to see the gender and culture layers of each type! Even more obvious when it comes to T(i) women and F(i) men. It’s fascinating! I see IxTP women as very cool and beautifully engaging their inferior Fe (cultural moulding maybe?), while most of the men look painfully introverted and unable to deal with Fe matters at all. Then you have INFP men masquerading as INTP. INTP women believing they are INFP. ISFP women as fierce and edgy, while the men are softer?? Ok I’ll stop now!

Add on top of that culture and, what to call it, generation? I noticed that it’s more difficult for me to see a certain type in some of the older videos which are linked, while I identify it much easier in more ‘contemporary’ manifestations of the type. This fucking globally exported pop culture which influences us all. Damn, probably even the way I speak English is made of little pieces of language I borrowed here and there and associated them with emotions and mannerisms… But then again, maybe I picked up the ones I already identified with in the first place. Even the way toddlers are throwing tantrums mimics the cartoons they watch… Sorry, what was I talking about? Do we even exist? It’s amazing how Blake can go past all that and see the essence of a type.

@nirdre Yeah, I can’t see anything other than INTP either at the moment. Androgynous. Yes! And also, I saw she identifies as pansexual.
I was reading some older posts on this topic and @schlopadoo’s message got my attention. I also can relate to that feeling of knowing I’m straight, but acknowledging physical attraction towards some women (though ‘physical’ attraction is never just physical and it’s almost always triggered by ENFJ women).

In conclusion, we are all pansexual and ENFJs are to blame. Mwah! :kissing_heart:


#19

Subscription renewed. The backer is back. Thank you, sacha :slightly_smiling_face:

So, why not ISFP? To me it seems the most obvious choice.

If MB type is to be looked at as a general pattern, sort of as an archetype, then to determine a person’s MB type would be something like using a sieve sparse enough to sift out all the idiosyncracies to catch the kernel of a person. That’s what Blake means when he talks about whole typing. Seeing the type as a whole.

In this sense, dissecting the interviews and seeking out all the particularities of a given celebrity in order to determine their overall type might be rather misleading. Firstly because the type is more than a sum of it’s functions. Secondly, now we know that subtypes might exist: INTJish ENFJs (PJ Harvey, etc.), ENTJish INFJs (at least Nietzsche), INFJish INTPs (at least Marie-Louise von Franz) and so on. The implications of this are huge. We’re in terra incognita. In suspense for further explanations from Blake.

So, let’s say Héloïse Letissier a.k.a. Christine and the Queens has some Ti, as @nirdre says. Does that make her INTP? First of all, how does INTP look like as a whole, i.e., what are we talking about? What are some famous examples of INTP women? If you check out Blake’s list, you’ll see only one example. And she’s no Christine. She’s a philologist and a psychiatrist. So we have nothing to compare. No continuum.

Now let’s place Christine into the list of famous INFJs. Do we see resemblances? I mean, whole type resemblances. Not really. Now ISFPs can resemble INFJs via Fi dom and Ni tert, as INFJs have Fi id and Ni dom. And ISFP is “natural mother” of INFJ who can resemble ISFP when in regressive state. But does Christine look like an INFJ at core? No.

And ENFJ? Does she really have that familiar energy of the temptress ENFJ? Overall, no. At least I don’t get that vibe from her. No mystery prior to sensuality. This video, the first one I saw. I thought I see Se aux and I was so obsessed with her performance that I have watched it like 30 times. In fascination and with envy from my own Se inferior. This is the video that made me think ISFP. Blake talks about ISFP/ENFJ confusion though. And ISFPs can resemble ENFJs the same way that INFJs can resemble ENTPs – when at their best.

I don’t know. My first impression was ISFP. And I cannot shake it off.

And I don’t think it’s just a coincidence that Christine is often spoken of in relation with Michael Jackson and Madonna (both ISFPs). The way she’s dressed up waist down in that videoclip of “Tilted” – clearly MJ style. So she wanted to look like him. Plus she was called “the new MJ” in some interview. Whether she is or not, is not the point (I think she isn’t, but neither was Madonna). The point is that she’s compared with him. In that same interview, she was also told that Madonna is obsessed with her. I’ve also seen some videos where Christine is on stage with Madonna herself. So they seem to get along. Then in another interview Christine says that she wants to be like Keith Richards. So she compares herself to yet another ISFP. And it doesn’t even matter to me that she thought herself unworthy of performing a song either by MJ, or Beyoncé (another ISFP, as schlopadoo argues and Blake complies). The fact is that Christine is clouded by ISFPs. She’s in ISFP world. And in my eyes she fits into the ISFP continuum herself.

Another thing that striked me as meaningful, was THIS FACE. Tell me it’s not female Harry Potter (Daniel Radcliffe) you see? And tell me HP is not yet another ISFP.

So, I think Christine is ISFP. I’m willing to be wrong, so I can learn more, but so far I’m not convinced otherwise.

And I want to suggest another option for @nirdre. Let’s throw out INTP because… Well, that would be a hell of a precedent to begin with. So here is what I suggest:

Christine is Gemini. Blake once wrote that “being a Gemini is a bit like being an ENTP’s auxiliary function of introverted thinking. The way an ENTP uses introverted thinking is totally different than the way an INTP would use it. ENTPs use it playfully and irreverently, in Dr. Seuss fashion.”

So what is she’s ENTPish ISFP?

But ISFP nevertheless.

The moment I’ve read these words, I immediately remembered @lunar and went straight to the Introduction thread to check out whether you are also INFP. That’s how crazy this whole thing of typing is. :dizzy_face:

Well, she said in one interview that beneath all her personae is “just sad little me” (cf. that Harry Potter face in the link above).

Anyway, let’s hope the next level Stellar Maze perception mages @Blake or @schlopadoo will pity our ignorance and reveal us the truth.


#20

So true…it becomes easy to overlook that MBTI is supposed to be archetypes and that “everything” doesn’t have to fit.

She seems to have good control over her body, and dances in most videos… seems Se. Her overall physically relaxed, funny vibe in interviews could just be Se and not Ne.
INTP seems hard to imagine- if she actually is INTP I’d be very surprised.
I don’t think INTP musician would even want to dance or be drawn to presenting their music this way. They’d generally be the ones who are creating softwares, and digital synthesisers and huge libraries of sounds, or maybe mixing. They are enthusiastic and creative with the minute details of music and thus good at sound designing… they’d probably also be good at scoring for movies. I’m not saying they cannot be performers, but I don’t think it’d look like this. [Disclaimer: I could be wrong]
Sorry I digressed from Christine, but INTP musician guesses (someone guessed INTP for Grimes too), just seemed off to me.