Logistical realities


My kiddo just punched me in the eye which hurt and annoyed me. He’s been oscillating today between being really sweet and focused on his legos and then being fully committed to fighting for control of the household. Like, his twin sister wants to watch Moana, and he screamed and fought for thirty minutes about it, until finally I heard him scream “I wanna watch Moana!” His aggression and volume are so intense that that is what a bad transition looks like for him. From violently freaking out in opposition to freaking out in favor. And so I switch from humming on his skull or something to “as soon as your body is calm and your voice is kind you can go right out and watch Moana.”

He’s only not at school today because he seemed sick yesterday when I picked him up and had an obvious fever this morning.

Last Friday I got myself into a campus to do some UX testing of a product I’ve been building for faculty, a campus visit I have been reticent to make and one I’ve known I’m procrastinating. I drove the 50 minutes to his school and dropped him off, the thirty minutes back, spent time on some other shit before realizing it was the day I needed to get to it and get some feedback from strangers, headed over to the closest university, and parked my van, when my phone rang. It was his school and they said he seemed sick and we should come get him. I almost couldn’t believe it. It’s a been a year that I’ve been pussy footing around raising money and starting a company, and the reason is my feeling of total lack of preparedness to manage the personal and family intrusions into my professional efforts, though I attempt to think it’s other things like not being ready with the software or whatever. Really it’s just that my wife can’t handle him and his twin sister isn’t much easier, and when everything doesn’t go perfect with their school schedule or whatever, uhhghg. I’m just fucked.

He’s screaming at me from his bedroom where I’ve locked him so he won’t attack anyone out here. Uggh. --Every person who tries to help us basically suggests that’s not okay anymore, you can’t lock your five year old in his bedroom. It’s like against the law. But not really. It’s like bad parenting. But having $-350 in my bank account is also bad parenting isn’t it? Letting his twin sister get attacked is bad parenting, isn’t it? Letting his 33 weeks along pregnant mom get attacked is bad family policy, no?

What in the actual fuck. It’s not that I think they’re should be a solution. It’s that I get annoyed when people act like there is. But I’m also way annoyed that we moved to the northwest where we don’t have my parents to help us. My mom knew it was a risky move to move up here. She felt my wife wouldn’t ever be able to handle the twins. Sounds mean but my mom is just an NT, speak some unvarnished analysis based on the patterns.

I am rather unfamiliar with panic as a physical or emotional state. This might be associated with my cognitive stack, and perhaps panic is something that stems from one of the functions I’m least consciously familiar with, which as entp would be


Or panic is curtailed by the functions I am deeply or unconsciously familiar with:

Te id

I often feel like expressing my frustration on this board with this kind of a post and I often am dishonest in this kind of a post. I say what makes sense or what I think I should say, like presenting this situation as frustrating and holding me back. My self pity is pretty low to be honest; I over represent it in such posts. In fact I think I have such a solidly internal locus for control and for change that I don’t truly have any self pity at root. I’m just annoyed and disappointed. I’m annoyed that it’s not easier to be free, or more meaningful to be not free. I’m annoyed that I’m capable of living so meaningless a life for so long, going on 18 months now since I got back from a separation with my family that enabled the most productive and exhilarating 7 months of my life. I’m annoyed that it doesn’t matter, that nothing in the universe really needs me to do anything different from what I’m doing. I’m annoyed that I can’t manipulate my wife into letting me fix our problems by any of the few surefire strategies I do in fact know would work, because she genuinely seems to believe that because it should be true that we can make it work here in the northwest, it is true.

But I guess I should be asking myself the "and then what"questions . Like

I’m not wanting to tell my wife I need her to give me $1000 dollars because I just don’t want the nuts loud response and violence today.

Why not? “Because there is a good chance I’ll come back at her like last week and accidently say all the true and brutal things again.”

And then what?

“And then she’ll tell me to leave and stuff and will get on her moralistic high horse about how I’m being abusive.”

And then what?

“And then I’ll probably come back at her and call her out on the abusive shit she does which will cause her Fi-Ni loop to take off worrying I’m logging all this shit in an effort to divorce her and take the kids. Which will really piss me off because how in the fucking hell could anyone who knows me even the tiniest bit imagine I would want to take custody of these children unless it was a necessity to keep them out of a foster home? How could she be so seriously blind to every single pattern and deaf to every single word? And then I’ll launch into one of my Uber-intense takedowns which will cause her to have it reaffirmed that I’m withholding my thoughts and views and ideas from her on a daily basis, or that, in her parlance, I am playing some long game in order to take her stuff and avoid child support. Which will piss me off further because who the fuck cares so much about their fucking stuff. God in heaven. So in short I will get pulled in to the dance we do when I forget to not get pulled in and we will both remember that we are completely incompatible and pretty much neither of us seriously knew that people like the other person existed until we have really gotten to know each other and, crucially, we will both forget, or I should say I’ll forget, that our marriage isn’t based on having anything in common or wanting any of the same things or enjoying each other’s presence, it’s based on some other thing that slips my mind easily and is easily buried beneath any of this stuff.”

And then what?

Then she will actively make my life harder until I apologize for saying “bitch” or whatever, while she will never apologize for freaking the fuck out and telling me how big of a loser I am and how hard a time she’s having coming to grips with it

And then what

Then I need to decide to play the part if I don’t want to deal with this kind of epic bitch fest on a legal level the way it happened when we separated for four weeks, though she had suggested six months, then she put a restraining order on me the day before I was coming back, shared a bunch of my writing with a therapist who had been encouraging her to snoop through my stuff, since my wife is kind of anti snoop by default, which the therapist decided made me dangerous and therefore called cps and lodged a record of me being dangerous, which then turned into my wife getting pressure from cps to file a restraining order or risk losing the kids. And when she turned in the first document the court admins said it didn’t make sense, wouldn’t garner a restraining order, and if she was trying to comply with cps she had better bulk up her story a bit, so she said I had “fled the state,” and other such nonsense. It’s hard to rewrite this stuff without being angry but I have seen my wife genuinely remorseful and recognizing how she naively moved into this hostile state of relationship not knowing it would get totally out of her hands. But I hate stupid people more than almost anything.

So I will play the part or become the opposition to a woman who I’ve since recognized does not have a win-win bone in her body. A scorched earther with every person she negotiates with. Best case scenario is I end up with what? Custody? No custody? Shared custody? Each of those strikes me as negative. I just want her to be a reasonable person. Fucking ISFPs.

And so then what

So then I play the part of apologetic husband and sort of forget to think about how bad she’s going to freak out if the car gets repossessed which I still have 28 days to sort out, or how she will be angry for 14 years if I get another ding on my credit, which happens in a couple days, or how I’m going to have to ask for her credit card for gas in my car this weekend since my account will probably have -450 by then…

I feel like an ESTP would just be like “later im going to go get $100k from that investor.” I have an appointment with that investor but like every fucking day it’s something with my family that chips away at my view that it’s sane for anyone to invest in a thing I’m doing when I know at core my family can’t deal with itself without me being on call. Jesus fuck, how many millions of times have I rehashed that thought: what does she think the world is going to do for her? How many times have I realized: “oh, her father wasn’t actually absent. He had a full time job.” How many of the ex boyfriends I’ve heard about who were always on call for their jobs and how much she hated that, me thinking she meant they were on vacation or at least Sunday afternoon, now realizing, remembering again and again, no, it was probably a Wednesday.

Anyway, I wish I knew how to panic and just deal with shit but it’s too easy to not worry about it and just read something interesting, since I don’t actually care if we were homeless or whatever. I need that leverage to get her to stop being delusional about what the world really is.

Meanwhile she has like $4k in a bank account from a tax return that she wants to “save” for the house she is convinced we can get by saving. Lol. Half the days of my life im going to be worth less than 0 dollars and on 10% of them im going to be worth millions and if she had any capacity to recognize that pattern shed know not to save money for a house. Just ask me to buy it in cash on one of the 10% days. Sure. Just don’t make me stay there for 10 years or whatever the amount of time is that you would need to stay anywhere to truly make owning a better financial option than renting.

Stupid dumb post.


This is some good morning pages.
Ask for the money for the car. Might as well add humble needful to your day.


I think you should get a divorce. That’s my honest opinion. And I don’t say that lightly.

The problem seems to be that you are happiest when you work. You can work very long hours and get in the zone etc. However, your wife can’t handle your son.

It doesn’t sound like you feel your wife can handle your son even for a day or two by herself. Is that correct?

It doesn’t sound like you would trust her to do so. And you and your son obviously have some special relationship and understanding ie you’re the only one who can really handle him.

At any rate, it’s going to be a difficult situation no matter what, but, I think you should consider what is going to release some positive energy in your life to help you get over the hurdle of the difficult.

I would say divorcing your wife (in this case) is necessary to that outcome.

I don’t think you will ever be happy with her.

And she is sapping a lot of energy from you.

Treat your relationship like you treat the work you did in corporate environment. And make decisions based on those criteria. Seriously.

You and your wife are simply incompatible. There is little that can be done about it. The most incompatible type for an ENTP is an ISFP. You have chosen the least compatible type.

Yes, you could bust your ass to make it work but it will be an uphill battle all the time. And it will never really settle. It will be like starting over all the time.

So, fuck it. Life’s too short. Divorce her. Get into your zone. Where you know you shine and hum. Figure out the kid thing. Yeah, it’s all bad in a sense (the options), but, I’m sure you can figure out the best fit.

I just think you just have to get serious about it. Your wife doesn’t understand you.

What I mean is that you’re going to have to be less passive about it. I think that is what you are loath to do. You’re wife sounds tough and bitchy if cornered and I think you’ll just be like “fuck it” and go along with the ride, however ill-fitting.

I sense that you want to divorce her though. So, keep that goal in mind and allow yourself to start forming a future where she isn’t in it. That might free up some positive energy for you to start getting into your work zone again, figure out the kid thing etc.

Point is you need to divorce her.

If you never get to that decisive place and are on the fence about it, I think your life will continue to feel sucky and hopeless.

That’s my advice. Free of charge. :grinning:


It sounds like you’re trying to please her too much. You’re forgetting about yourself. And I’ve seen you say quite recently in posts that you love her and are fond of her. I would re-evaluate those feelings. I also remember you asking me a lot of questions because you thought your wife was an ENFJ. And you were wondering why she had changed so much from when you two met to now.

It seems like to me, you’re holding on to old memories and old feeling and even old realities. I’m sure you love her and she loves you. Why wouldn’t you two? Married, children, and another on the way, right?

But your whole money situation does not sit well with me. You make it sound like you two don’t even live together. Living in two different worlds. And it’s sad you feel like you can’t ask her for the money. And the car being repossessed? All of this with no open communication. Communication and understanding. I fee like those two things are very important.

So, let me try to get a clear picture. Remember when you said you “didn’t” fuck your wife against the wall? Remember how you told her she almost fucked you over, ruined your life? It sounds like to me, you are unhappy with her, but would rather be unhappy than have your life be ruined - (the possibility of).

So, decisions, decisions.

I will say, if you want her to have a clearer understanding of how the world works and realities and shit, tell her about the money. Lay it all the fuck out. Because right now, you’re enabling her. You are creating a lot of your unhappiness.


[quote=“johnonymous, post:1, topic:220”]
Anyway, I wish I knew how to panic and just deal with shit but it’s too easy to not worry about it and just read something interesting, since I don’t actually care if we were homeless or whatever. [/quote]
I wanna say first off, you are in a state of panic or high anxiety. Te version of panic? Not really Fi version. I say this because when I was having “panic attacks” it would just be numbness and apathy toward whatever my tasks were supposed to be and got myself distracted (with the internet lol) instead. Blew my chance at earning my master’s that way because I couldn’t be arsed to pull it together to muster 4 months of Fe-ing–with possibility of damning myself into a career of it–so overall, maybe it was for my own good! :stuck_out_tongue:

You are also probably going through Si-grip state, since you’re just going over your history and circumstances with your wife without really asking for anything here.

Addition: you are both probably fairly bad at the Si-business of dealing with daily life and routine. It being your inferior and her id/trigger into spirals… but when dealing with aspergers/autism, strong Si-game is really important for setting those boundaries/creating a sense of safe environment for kids who have all sorts of sensory integration issues. It may be impressively hard to juggle this between you two, and you may need more third-party help.

I do not think you are the person who can do this. She need like… true peer pressure… from someone she respects. (Not you. I think most ISFP see their spouses/S.O.s as for their convenience/at their pleasure, so they will have a meltdown if you upset this mental image). If she had an ENFJ friend to kick her ass, that would probably do it… hahah! I’d say to hook her up with Erika, but she’d probably think you were trying to cheat on her with Erika and give you an even bigger headache.

You might have to give up on her (and ISFP in general) ever being “rational”. It’s not really in their make up. Just appreciate her for what she is: probably hot/cute and whatever personal skillset she has (self-preservation? lol).

You probably need to convince her that hiring help for the home would make things easier. Of course, that’s my advice for my ISFP family member too… lol. If ISFP is not good at taking care of the home, don’t depend on her to be good at it: hire out. Therefore, focus on making the big monies to make this possible, John!
On the plus side, no matter what you do, she will never leave you! She will file restraining orders and tell you to leave and make your life hell, but as long as you don’t go, she knows she also has nowhere to go! See? Win-win. You didn’t think she had it in her, but there you are!

She probably drags you into the middle of nowhere so she can isolate you from all your supports so you can need her as much as she needs you. But uh… I guess her calculus is off, because you are still the much more capable one from what I can tell (besides terrible banking issues–ENTP: good at making money, bad at maintaining money?). Thus, she rages at you in order to bring you down on her level.

Solution: hire help so you can both depend on the help and ease off the asymmetrical dynamics but it also allowing you to keep up the illusion that this is but a lifestyle choice and you are just well-to-do. Wow!**

** Then the help will be abused by her. Which will set you off. Which will make you divorce her. Thus many solution!


this is correct. I know that what my son needs is consistency and boundaries, or at least one of those two things. I can provide consistency and my wife can provide boundaries – I am consistent in my approach to living but have no boundaries for kid behavior. She has intense boundaries and some degree of consistency. Together we create a clusterfuck. She’s the better parent for him but she can’t stand him. She can’t believe how boldly and brazenly he attempts to control the family. She’s never really been exposed to this kind of dismissal of authority or lack of fear. I have this kind of dismissal of authority in my head so I can relate and thus often am more accepting of the challenge of the kid. It’s a couple of mediocre parents with a unique type of requirement we are both mediocre at handling and kind of deserve an F when we work together on it. Yuck. I hate believing it’s an actually shit situation. Ugh. Historical context says it’s an average situation. But historically these kids were sent away and disappeared. (Sidenote: Anybody interested in autism read Steve Silverman’s Nuerotribes to understand why it appears that autism has suddenly exploded among us-- it’s this historical disappearance of kids like this, and many other things, that contribute to that mirage – Silberman is a wired writer and a great researcher/journalist and very readable guy. )


Lol. I appreciate your advice and yours as well @Blake and @Ankh. Prax, it’s true, I need to make the monies again for us. And my wife has no prob with me hiring help, in fact, when something hasn’t happened within a few weeks of her asking it she’s like “hey will you hire someone to do that since you aren’t going to do it or do I need to hire someone to do it?” She’s threatened to hire people for tiny things and I like that about her except that she burns through service providers because she is incredibly weak at communicating via text for logistics. Inferior Te maybe.

We used to spend $3800 a month on childcare. We burn through nannies like nobody’s business but we can keep finding more. I’ve seen them crying and one came to me once after working for her for the whole time we were separated, in tears trying to understand why she is so hard on her, saying like, “I love her so much I just don’t understand why she doesn’t see how hard I’m trying!” Haha. I feel sad that my wife makes people feel so upset. Right now we have this 19 year old Russian girl who is probably an ISFJ helping us. She grew up as the oldest in an Uber religious giant family (russian Christian groups who came here after the fall of the ussr probably run the gamut but in this area there are at least some super conservative traditions) so she’s a tough lil babushka and has an autistic son/little brother and I have high hopes though I admit I had some concerns about wifey’s being able to handle her Fe and it’s proved pretty intense between the two so far. Actually this girl might be an ENFJ. Showed up in an LBD on day one and I was like what. In. The. Actual. Fuck. Turns out she left the family church and married some liberal Russian guy already Cuz they are going to some church she described as not serious and “a relief.”

And @Prax you are right about this.

I think this is what subconsciously attracted me to her. The conscious reason I fell for her and still do is sexual chemistry. I’ve gained a lot from being with her, particularly in the arena of learning to be more masculine and more tough. And when we met I saw her as being liberally minded and edgy–which was a faulty conclusion and based on my thinking that women who were sexually unashamed and in their thirties and living in big cities were edgy. Plus she lied about her openness and views on pornography, which I was writing some intense critical essays about right then (which I pressumed, wrongly, she read before fucking marrying me lol). From my vantage point, coming out of Mormonism, she was out on the edge. I didn’t give myself a chance to get a good sense of her motion or I would have recognized she wasn’t moving, or she was contracting, not expanding. I misread that. And misread her frustration with my lifestyle of transience as just not liking the city She was living in which had altitude of 9,000 feet so I thought her depression was like altitude sickness. Hah. Dumb me. Fifty times I could have ended the relationship but didn’t and then got engaged and then 8 weeks before the wedding pregnant with twins from one dumb time after which she took a plan B pill lol. Plan C and D I call them.

But yeah she won’t ever leave me, and it’s so weird how hard it is for me to remember. So weird how vulnerable I am to my own perceptions and how she (I believe unstrategically/unintentionally) scrambles my ability to predict and messes with my ability to quantify consequences and make rational decisions (business-like, like @Blake said). And I always get the sense I have scrambled her perceiver and surprised her with my behavior as well.

she will never leave me, not in any way that will be more of a problem for me than today is a problem for me. Like the problem for me is not what could happen in the future but what is happening in the present and I must remember that. I can change the problems by changing the present. By walking out of the house for example. I can’t predict that a future will be worse because the day is bad. In fact she always is better after I act like an asshole.

One of my older sisters once said this it just as clearly as you have Here Praxumous, not long after ISFP had filed the restraining order against me and was planning to file for divorce. It was like I was Chatting with EN(?f?)P sister and concerned about some stuff and she suddenly realized that I wasn’t in on something that the rest of the world was: “oh, umm, So _____ is never going to leave you. It will never happen.” It was one of the most difinitive statements I’ve ever heard my only known other primary extroverted intuitive sibling make. And I knew she was right after she said it, but I then forgot that later when she filed for divorce and such. And i thought for a long time she was actually trying to ruin my life. But in fact she was trying to get me to come back/make her feel better.

I think for now I am going to force myself to remember to think

“Yeah, and: she won’t ever leave me. So given that, what do I want to do?”


Hey, no probs. What are forum friends for? Oooo! Sounds like a superhero team. Forum Friends Four!! Cool! We could like wear cool rings and say shit like, “Forum Friends, unite!!!” And, “dude your Fe is outta wack.” All while weraring capes. Ooo! And we could have our types on the front. Big ENFJ across my chest. Yeah, I can see it now. And we could have a cartoon show that’s somewhat awkward and erotic. Erotically awkward or awkwardly erotic. Something like that. And @Prax can take care of the comic.

Yeah, but anyways, you’re welcome.


I’m literally in the last stages of preparing for a long haul flight, but I’m thinking of you, too, and will post my thoughts and ideas whenever I have internet access, so brief and sporadic for a few days.

Things will improve for you, they most certainly will! We just have to figure out how…


Wow! many paragraph! You must need to vent!
And yeah, I wanna check that book out–or make ISFP fam check it out lol. She is so similar to your wife though maybe more damaged self-esteem and social anxieties, thus less propensity to yell at anyone lol. Her communication with even her own care providers (doctors, therapists, etc) is terrible and never enough info for them to give her help she needs, so I can only imagine how bad your wife may be.

I think your wife may be using boundaries as a mode of survival more than as a a good way to corral your kids lol. Te inferior. This is probably hard on her too. But I hope indeed ISFJ (who are good with Si tasks and not letting self be truly bullied) works out! Or if it’s ESFJ (who can be loud) or ENFJ (who are not gonna let her get away with stuff), they will bulldoze around her and give her much-needed real boundaries.

I had to sleep before going to work, but i yam down with the sickness (a cold–but since i got some asthma and allergies, my colds can be miserable for my lungs), so my 4 hour sleep/nap was very broken with coughing and mucus fits–anyway! My dreams were infected with thoughts of you! i don’t remember clearly, but I think you were developing apps or programming something. So make my dreams come true~~ Develop your startup and make many money!

(What you should really do is add pagination option to discourse forums lol)


I had this problem with my wife…where she wasn’t capable of seeing the win win. There was always only a right or wrong way from her perspective. I had to create the win win on my own without her help or permission. Intuition works great for win wins. It may have been an unhealthy way of doing it though. I had to lie. I had to disguise it as her getting her way, because she did…but I also got my way. It took a lot of effort to put my ego and desire for her to understand aside.

I’m not casting my ballot for weather you should divorce or not. My wife’s an Isfj and I’m an Infj and/or Enfj…we’re not the worst compatibility. So my situation is different. She’s at least aware and accepting of my weirdo intuitive traits. But I just wanted to vent myself. Cause part of me aches that I can’t be fully honest with her.

I wish the best for your situation @johnonymous.


I wish I could figure out how to “like” posts from my tablet device, 'cos I really laughed at your comments @Ankh.

So now we have to come up with a cool Superhero team name for our strange ragtag group of mutant psychic sex heroes…


Kinda like family force five


We could randomly drive around like Galantis in this video, using our combined superpowers to bring joy to the downtrodden masses:


Or LunchMoney Lewis in this one:


How about something like Freaky Forum Friends, inspired by this video:


And I can’t resist throwing this one in as well, because, well Ylvis are so freaking cool:


Dude, this sounds awesome!!!