Right, Left, Trump, Apollo, Dionysus, Te, Fi


#1

Te and Fi are so antagonistic. I literally get an image of crush and/versus chaos, iron fist and fire. With Ti and Fe I never get a dramatic image. More like dry versus expressive, philosophically jewelled. (so that is the nuance of thinking and expressing, Blake mentioned nuance) And yeah I’m sure this isn’t an actual topic…help.

Guess with Te you put a stop sign somewhere.

It’s that stop sign that is the flip side of Fi, that makes Fi itself seem potentially antagonistic, like within the “left”.


#2

You should link to the relevant post, Lunar! lol
I didn’t get to listen to the recording yet, but someone should… provide a transcript or summary for those of us who have no audio too. :smiley:


#3

Here is the link:


#4

In summary, @Blake opens discussion for and identifies the Dinoysian and Apollonian balance of life and how it’s evidence can be seen in the most recent presidential election.

I am a liberal, I guess you can say. Or, perhaps, I am more left than right. I’m a peace-loving, nature freak, man. Groovy.

Americans want something to fight for. It’s in our nature. Fight for freedom!!! Yeah! Trump in his current position as our President, sets the stage for debate and fighting for our rights. It inspires a time of contemplation on the nation’s current state and where it will lead. And, everyone has an opinion.

I totally get it - things weren’t working out. Understandable. We could all see it, and America spoke. Actually, they won’t shut up. No matter what side we’re on, we can all agree on a few things and one of them is Trump opened a lot of doors. He has no political background. But he’s the President. What an accomplishment. I am sure a lot of “non-political” candidates are already prepping for their stab at the next election.

It’s been under a month and I think we need to realize that. The media, no matter what bias they have, are in fact the media. It’s their job to report news - falsified or not. So, no matter what the fuel is used for, they like to burn shit.

I think a lot of you know about my unknowing of typology, but I would like to take a stab at this. Introverted feeling. Yes, I do think caring about someone’s well-being is all Fi. Just like Blake said/says, it’s not bad or good. It just is. Maybe, Fi is more “true”, but Fe expands to many more people. Let’s look at the ban - travel ban, immigration ban, whatever. Someone presenting with Fi would look at this on a small scale, and say, “This is unfair to the good people. We should help those people.” Fe would say, “I care about these people too, but let’s look at the ramifications of this. We could be letting in bad people too. And what about the safety of our people? And how would this effect our economy?” Fi doesn’t care about that. All it cares about it doing good. What feels good, and right, morally right. Am I correct in thinking Fi is predominantly inactive, where Fe is active? Just trying to make some associations? Am I right people? Or way off?

Other notes:

I do appreciate how Blake takes a second to put this all in perspective. Where we are today, didn’t happen overnight. Although it feels like it to people who hold things close to their morals. We are a young country in a new age, so there are going to be a lot of growing pains.


#5

@Blake As usual with everything you do, you’ve given me lots of thoughts to process. I was looking for the “like” button but couldn’t find it. :grinning:Jk I will have to come back to this after work.


#8

Random thoughts that I will piece together later:
1)If shits off balance you don’t go in the complete opposite direction.That energizes the other side to go back the other way. And it will just keep going back and fourth. #clusterfuck

2)Is caring about people’s well being really all Fi? Thier are tiny issues that get blown out of proportion… (a shit load of tiny issues) but is it really bad to feel bad about something that genuinely oppresses a group of people… especially when it hits close to home?

3)don’t care if we call it a Muslim ban or not. Don’t care if he builds a wall. He ran on inconsiderate agendas. He ran as a dick head with no values. I’d be much cooler with him if he focused on economics.

4)Hes a business man. Business men make risky desisions. If a company tanks the CEO has to settle for no private jet. If the country tanks? Fuck!

5)Positives on Trump
-Wants to make shit happen
-Distroying the biased media
-Destroying political correctness
-Calling out all politicians for not focusing on the people (they’re more focused on sacrifices of integrity to get re elected… with disregard for getting shit accomplished )

6)The checks and balances in government and economics are not being re evaluated enough. They just go one way or the other. No ones focusing on making sure incentives and disciplines on corporations for people’s financial development are working. The dems have an unrealistic robin-hood mentality, and republicans have an imaginary trickle down my nuts mentality. (I know this thought wasn’t a point of topic, but I had to get this out of my head before I forgot.)

7)Trumps not a dictator. He’s an asswhole. Fi is definitely bitching for the wrong reasons. But there’s lots of peeps with a strong Fe understanding of this situation who just hate dealing with an Asswhole…it’s just that simple sometimes. I don’t passionately hate Trump. It’s more like dude, shut the fuck up already, I get it you’re terrific, I just want to know if you can cut my taxes already. Let me get something out of this sloppy deal.


#9

So…this is so uninteresting a thing to say…basically I have no real steady opinion of Trump. How interesting.

But I just want to say I’ve had my point of view busted by some of the things Blake has said and I love that.


#10

That makes sense actually. Fe being more of the overall “vibe.” Fi chooses to take a side based on subjective principle. Congrats! You are officially not the worst educated in typology. :joy:


#11

With Trump, one early thing about him I could never get around was his fake university. So I understand what you mean by one thing is a deal breaker.


#12

So looking back at my rushed random first thoughts that I wrote on my way to work, I can see the covered up Fi all over it. You’ve made your point for what your main focus was. Lol

@Blake You mentioned in the recording that people yell at you for what you write about INFJ’s, cause we’re sensitive. Yes we’re sensitive but we love to develop ourselves… I grin every time I read your unflattering thoughts on INFJ’s. It actually did the opposite of what your critics were telling you it would do to INFJ’s. At least for me. So I’m hoping they haven’t deterred you from writing candidly about types.


#13

Han shot first.

Okay, just had to get that out.

I am also remaining in the background as much as I can as I review, kind of haphazardly as they come, the bites I get of what is going on Trump [geez, I can’t bring myself to say wise]. But am purposely not going places where my own Fi will freak the fuck out. No Facebook. I agree, Blake. I went the other day to enjoy some pics of friends, to see how people are doing that I care about. It was like being in a snowstorm. I was distracted immediately and backed out before long. I used to be there way too much, and began to feel this desire to smack everyone. I left mostly but hesitate to dismantle my pictures for family. Not that I put many up anymore… honestly one of the big reason’s I left was the disagreement between vaccinators and non vaccinators. And please don’t bring that up with me personally. I don’t want to go there for a long while.
Honestly, I haven’t watched Trump yet and have only heard things and yes, I see the danger in that. I see that I have been biased to a degree by Fi fear.
I am in my own fucking tangle and it actually parallels what is going on between Te and Fi, but hold on for a minute on that.
If he is an ENTJ, then my hope must reside in his Fi, curiously enough. I must hope there is a line over which peril exists for him and that he himself will hesitate to cross.
Damn! Fuck. I think I may have to investigate a bit more eventually…
Sorry. All my thoughts are scattery at the moment.
So, I am not going to lay it all out, but basically I have also come to a place where I must draw my line in the sand and say sorry, I have done as much as I could. I am falling apart. At this point, anything asked of me is just one more rotten board, one more screw loose that is not getting fixed cause I have no time or space to rebuild. And so I am coming to understand lines, specifically that there have to be lines. Everyone has a line. And if they don’t, well, give it time and lots of people crossing it and you will in fact start looking for a stick to draw it with.
I also want to talk about PC, and more on Fi, but refer to my first line and I’ll come back later.


#14

This is the thing about the wall though, and lines, is that as soon as you draw them, people start inventing ways to cross them. And then like the ban on drugs, it becomes a black market thing, where extortion and corruption reign. So, while we must say whoa there, we really need to think about the kind of line we draw.

And I have people on the other side…


#15

Had the exact same thought. Was gonna word it as hopefully his Fi works like a silver lining. Fi hovers over him like an angel with a little voice from time to time to help him reorient. I think that would make sense for an entj.


#17

@Blake
the origin of the line is a fun thing to think about…
would help to know more history.
plows used to be hard to turn around, so you go in a straight line but obviously at some pt you have to turn back around, then you repeat. get rectangle. that kind of thing. but way too late in history. maybe still something to do with agriculture and “rows” that arise from having to turn back around.
or stacking objects…yes, or rather packing units. hmmm. you could stack them in circular wall.
in any case, in nature you don’t go about seeing rectangles:) so if one were to assign a shape to Te, why not the rectangle:) although maybe this spatial ordering is Ti. shoot.

time for some looking stuff up


#18

maybe land surveying. although that can be nonrectangular.

building. maybe if the coarse blocks with which you build are made by division applied to a “linear” item, it’s just fated for things to have right angles. do things in a line, then repeated division to make units all similar to each other. oh. that’s what it is probably. so uniformity of units that kind of thing. or keeping the weather out, to close in all the gaps you gradually realize you can use rectangularish blocks. Ti or Te? cool how igloos are different though. but the pieces still join up with right angles at their corners. so maybe right angles just come from orienting up relative to land. prevents one piece from bearing on neighboring piece. no wedging sideways. hmm maybe it’s the ramp that came first. gives your right triangle. or maybe just maybe people have always had these pure interests in math. unconnected to any kind of engineering.Ti. but maybe it comes down to gravity mostly at right angle to surface.


#20

I am really grossed out by the actions of Schultz and Brazille and party…just grossed out the democratic party gangs up against one of their nominees. It is hard to pay attention to politics because it is like watching games of vomit.


#21

Just let it all out, your soul will thank you for it. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

@lml
Yup! Picking one side almost obligates you to adopt every single veiw of that party. Don’t know if I could ever fully adopt all of one party’s views, wether it’s a third party or dem/rep party.

@Ni
If people could just open up their eyes enough to just call out their own bull shit it would make a world of a difference.


#22

Hmm. Interesting. And this is Fi, correct?

I’m intrigued by the analogous way in which I think Ti operates. One innacurate thing means the equation is incorrect. One wrong minus sign.

VS both the extroverted judging functions that say, “ends justify means.”


#23

Like Parker and or Stone who created South Park said, approximately:

I hate republicans, but I really fucking hate democrats.


#24

Is it possible, folks, that the two party back and forth is close to an optimal state? I struggle to see the true advantage in an actual third party that’s viable. I mean advantage as compared to now.

Trump seems third party to me. Look at Rubio and Cruz and McConnell and trump. One of these things is not like the other.

Give one party every branch of government and one party starts looking like three. Suddenly the 400 times Obamacare was repealed in the house don’t mean shit. Obamacare won’t be repealed because republicans do not have a single party view on it in reality. Any minority party can pretend to be fully united in opposition, but give them the whole government and you’ll find your moderates in their ranks immediately. That’s my view.