btw. the INTJ guy does make some good points though.
i think he’s frustrated.
start at 21:14, he talks about how mbti creates stereotypes and biases that cause dissension.
but i’m just sadden how he’s just dropping everything.
the point he’s making is basically “we’re all humans, we can all relate to each other one way or the other, but this typology is corrupt because it divides people, so i’m just gonna completely disregard this so i stop judging people based on their types”
i like THAT point though.
but i still find mbti one of the most accurate typology tool that makes sense to me.
I put first guy on headphones while doing chores and probably would have stopped listening if you hadn’t tagged me. First 2/3 basically blah blah blah scientism. He’s burning Ni on an altar to Ti, and scientism seems to especially wreck NT types. No, MBTI does not fit an empirical science model, linear physics are consistent and predictable, life, people, and personality are not. MBTI is a tool for pattern recognition in an unpredictable system. My Fi does agree with him that it can lead to silly things like making hierarchies of types or weak, self-limiting things like choosing a partner or a job based on MBTI. The goal in both MBTI and astrology is to move toward the center of the circle.
The last 1/3 was more amusing where he denounces MBTI as related to astrology, divination, and mystery religions. Did you know Jung was interested in the occult?! (yeah, fool, I did). I don’t even think cognitive functions as interesting as a lot of Jung’s other ideas, but there is something in there that modern people are deeply deprived in and it makes it more palatable to the masses to dress it up as science-y and that’s become the part that is popular. I happen to think ancient people were better at intuitively understanding nature and using symbolism to understand patterns in chaotic systems. Astrology has been simmering for 3000+ years so to me correlation with MBTI is brilliant and adds depth. Then blah blah blah, if you’re an atheist you should eschew MBTI because it’s not scientific, if you’re a Christian you should eschew it because dude quotes a couple bible passages and paganism is evil- as if there are no other options besides scientism and fundamentalism.
I might listen to other 2 guys later, if Ti dom is arguing that MBTI is properly scientific I probably disagree with him too.
haven’t watched any of the videos yet. might when i wake up, but my first guess is:
he ran into many interpersonal problems and the question of “if i’m right, then why did i fail?” and this is his conclusion… that he was not right with mbti haha
he ran into a bunch of people who whined at at him why mbti this or that and clung too hard onto mbti as a crutch and he grew disgusted and bitter with these mindless masses and now rejects them all along with their mbti “religion” lol??
I watched a bit of the video and read his article on the blog which I guess is a concise version of the same…
By his own admission it seems he started questioning mbti when someone told him Carl Jung was into occult, which I guess he didn’t know and that seems to have affected his views on Jung’s theories… and that opened up a can of worms for him leading him to fixate on all things “wrong” with mbti and the people following it.
But I find it very ironic that in one part he says (not exact words) "Eastern philosophies and false religions and did you know Star wars has Buddhist symbolism and its all so evil’ and then states “Jesus saved me!!”…!!
I think he’ll move on to make videos on Christianity and pray and “save” people by exposing the “evil Carl Jung and other eastern stuff”
[quote="supernokturnal, post:7, topic:462”](quoting me)
scientism seems to especially wreck NT type
Scientism is the practice of considering science, and to some extent logic, as truth and discarding everything else. It seems to be the default religion of those who consider themselves too intelligent and rational to actually practice religion. I love actual science and university scientists who define their theories more as ‘best working model’ than ‘truth’ and hold some underlying fascination at the mystery of how much they just don’t understand even in their small, specific field of expertise. Science is a great tool that can help to explain and understand many things, but it is limited. It seems like NT types with a more superficial science background fall most easily into a trap of believing science can be the answer to everything and limit their bandwidth to areas that they can at least put a scientific spin on things- so there’s the stereotype of INTX as robotic, ENTJ as ruthless commanders- and ENTP is a wild card so never mind them. ST and even feeling types might espouse a view of scientism too, but sensing function keeps people a little more grounded in reality, and feeling function naturally expands perception beyond the scientific world view.
This guy, however, seems to be religious. Either that, or he’s trying to reach “rationals” by calling typology “pseudoscience” and reaching “religious people” by calling it an indulgence in satanic/occult practices!
normal? I don’t think so.
Is he definitely INTJ? I have never seen his videos before, so just wondered.
But he could be I guess, he certainly makes confident and logical-sounding points. Like categorising typology as inaccurate/inconsistent and therefore wrong.
But most people into mbti aren’t expecting that sort of thing anyway. Even science allows imperfections in measurements/results (which can be really high based on the field)
Maybe his behaviour could fit Blake’s idea of egalitarian Vs. elitist warped-logic driving personal agenda trap, taken to an extreme.
Ti id = distorted categorising of typology and people indulging in it
Ni agenda = Religion/Belief in Christianity
Also, doesn’t he kind of look like Christian Bale?
It has been said that INTJs are the most future-oriented thinkers of all the 16 types. Have you thought about your death? Are you prepared to die? Have you given adequate consideration or research into the matter? I hope you’ll get saved by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ today.
Haha, reaching out to MBTI TYPE after all the typology-trashing
I did listen to Ti guy and he does have a better understanding of role of science and inherent issues in applying empirical measures to to subjective criteria. He is dry and drone-y, but it seemed like he was trying to expand and clarify his ideas rather than blah blah blah saying the same thing again and again. Sort of a soothing sensation to listen to- maybe I’m picking up some Si as 2nd guy described- I listened to him too. 2nd one I may go back and give undivided attention to, was sort of harder to follow him while doing chores. Ti guy also devalued importance of mysticism, said something about INTJ dude going on about astrology and Philemon was insulting to those who found value in typology. really it’s a parallel/continuation on a theme in Nietzsche’s Zarathustra, never mind
Minored in psychology in college and Jung and MBTI piqued my interest then. This is ~25 years ago so was pretty much restricted to resources I could find at library then moved on to other things. Remembered it about a year ago when 12 year ENFP took 16 personalities test and showed me his ENFP result (he’s also been assigned to Gryffindor by sorting hat), so I said,
“oh, yeah, you are an ENFP honey.”
A few lights came on to help understand my kid and lots of stuff on internet now. Can’t exactly remember how I came across Blake’s articles; here’s he’s cobbled MBTI, Freudian functions, and astrology into a hell of an impressive working model, but it’s not at all scientific.
Evidently, he thinks these are the 2 alternatives that people can believe in; thank goodness he’s dead wrong on that one.
Maybe not, but mysticism and especially symbology seems like a Ni enhancer to me, endless connections and pattern recognition. It bypasses Te/Ti, sort of like how a Se dom might quickly pick up the knack of skiing or snowboarding without lessons or thinking through- now I need to shift my weight and turn a little etc.- he just does it.
16 year old ESTP: I don’t know why people take all these lessons and still flop around and can’t get down the hill without falling; I did it the first time with no lessons. ISTP: smirks and nods XXFX: looks hurt and goes to chat with someone else and drink hot cocoa XSTJ: expounds on why lessons are important XNTX: beats ESTP with ski poles and stuffs him in a snow bank
I think of scientific as something subject to testing by scientific method with results that are valid and reliable.
12 year old boys don’t like being called “honey” much, but sometimes he is.
I haven’t watched the video but MBTI transects the occult a lot. It is definitely not scientific, its closer to magic (and as the people on this forum may have noted, astrology; also occult). There is a systemizing veneer on top of it that takes from the vocabulary of the modern world. The psychoanalysis by active imagination that Carl Jung used to engage in is almost exactly the same process as alchemical meditation and also relates to western ritual magick (at least the intersections cannot be missed by anyone even passingly familiar): http://www.jungny.com/carl.jung.248.html
How his motivations and opinions break down into an expression of his functions, I don’t know, but the Ti id explanation makes sense to me. This explains how he has chosen to speak about this issue, but it is an issue with MBTI regardless. It is presented in a scientific way, its aesthetic simply is scientific seeming and that’s how most people will process it when they encounter it. Perhaps some other type will express this frustration or apparent disillusionment in some other terms, but they will do it.
I don’t think I’ll ever watch the videos. I’ve often seen his videos in sidebars and in my searches, but he just looks like a dork to me. May not be justified but I like my current understanding.