Being a cliche.
Yes. Also being “ordinary” instead of “special”.
Dying without understanding.
Dying without being understood.
Your first fear is one of mine.
And actually pretty much guaranteed we die without understanding!
Damn, @piggie! That’s fucking sad! Can you elaborate on the last one? Being understood. Why would that be one of INFJs biggest fears? Why is it one of yours?
Maybe: Being understood as an imbecile baby and then no one likes that baby. ;-;
As my friend puts it: “Ooohhh people know I am bad…now nobody likes me and I deserve it too… ”
I guess that’s a cliche. Self-hating tragic character.
Hmmmm…I take that as the piggie’s second item: Dying without being understood. But, I suppose an INFJ wouldn’t see it like that and an INTJ would call them on that! lol
No, that is being understood.
You understand them for what they are and you don’t like it (but they happen to like you). lol That is max tragedy for INFJ.
But what is the reasoning for looking like a baby/being a baby? INFJs would probably believe they’re anything at any given moment. They don’t know who they are. So, if you tell them they’re a baby, they’ll think that, and be the best damn baby there is. But if you don’t accept that or that behavior and try to find out why it is why they are…then bam, that is understanding them.
They look they are being like a baby because that could just be their reactionary garbage and/or idealist soul, and a particular person could just dislike them for that essential part of themselves even if they understood how and why. I can hate plenty despite understanding. lol
I don’t think INFJ necessarily believe they’re anything just because you tell them. They might take it to heart and question it if they value your opinions and then get angry you were wrong and maybe tried to mislead them about themselves, or get angry you were right and then angry at themselves for self-fulfilling prophecy (lol).
Usually, it seems that INFJ are shocked by how intense or irrational their feelings can be (Fi-id problems?), and that causes them self-doubts (do I feel this way because I am bad person? am i so sad because i am so weak? am i angry because they are right and i’m wrong? do i not live up to my own values and am hypocrite!!!), but I don’t think they necessarily embody what other people think of them and take it as their true self… it kind of gets more introspected on, where their own feelings about themselves matter most. It’s more others who they care about disliking them validates their own negative opinions of themselves… the fear that they were right all along, that they were terrible (being an imbecile baby on top of it is icing because it denotes immaturity, lack of true awareness).
I just mostly find it funny though. Baby thrashings.
It is like excessive shame. Crippling. The feelings are there tainting their words and actions but they don’t want that to be seen. They are not in control. It is vulnerable. And not that pretty. Not safe.
Oh man… I feel like I shouldn’t have said that now… cause I don’t know whether it applies to all INFJs
In my case, three reasons…
One… as Stewart mentioned earlier… being “special” is a matter of great importance… maybe being understood makes me feel less special(?)…
Two… I feel like understanding is the culmination… there’s nothing new to discover after something has been understood to the T… understanding causes restlessness and boredom… so… if someone understood me there would be nothing left…
Three… and this is probably the most important point… I can’t handle the exposure… it would mean that I have lost the upper hand… to know that a person really knows what’s going on in my head is a really scary thought, because I like being the one in control…
Lol and another fear is that people will think I’m not a nice person even when I am trying to be one… umm… so that’s a fear of being misunderstood I guess?
Yeah, but, being a cliche is worse than all that stuff. If an INFJ can be an original baby (that is, an uncliched one), then, they are fine.
It’s more the secret fear that after all that drama of despair (being misunderstood, being understood, shame, guilt, etc), that they are just like everyone else. And therefore, they are a cliche.
I think an INFJ would go through hell just to prove they are not a cliche.
And isn’t that interesting in the final analysis.
The very thing that would justify all the suffering and emotional torment an INFJ is prone to is the knowledge that they are special.
And the icing on the cake would be that they are special in a way that can be summed up in an elegant formula.
I think this drive of INFJ is actually why they fear being understood. They are afraid people will see how truly self-involved they are beneath all their humanistic rhetoric and noble sentiments.
It’s OK INFJs. I love you more knowing this about you. It makes you that much more…interesting.
An original baby. Aww man cute.
Infjs always look like “you think you discovered me? you are off by two shades. I am two shades deeper, more subtly selfless than you can comprehend than what you just saw in my tantrum…” It is like whoops someone saw them. And it wasn’t pretty.
Infjs are beautiful and I am tired of it you infjs…stop being so goddamm poetic, please enthrall me no longer…
INFJs seem like they need to get over themselves and finite things they can’t control. But mostly the former.
So basically, you let society scare you into loneliness?
@piggie, let me ask you an insanely personal question that I’m hoping you may elaborate on.
Have you ever let someone in to truly see you? Given someone the opportunity to understand you and know you?
I think INFJ are hardpressed to “get over themselves” for they are Ni-dom. That is their modus-operandi. Navel-gazing is their domain (same with INTJ, but less emotion involved). This is like telling ENFJ to get over trying to get people to like them when in one to one conversation. That’s a mode of being and control that holds the pieces together.
I think on some level, all of us are affected by social pressures, but it seems like many INFJ ails come from their own hearts and views of themselves or of people whose opinions they respect (but it all comes back to themselves anyway. It’s the difference of self-hating shames vs being hated shames).
Being cliche or unspecial is more self-judgment stuff. If an INFJ does not care for the ignorant masses, it does not matter if they do not hold INFJ special as long as the INFJ has that conviction already–and then their greatest fear becvomes letting themselves down by letting others down (showing they are weak/short of high standards/values they love). In contrast, INTJ not usually have this problem because they all “know” they are special or outliers, otherwise the world would not frustrate them so much lol.
An exquisite pain. Thanks guys. Feeling the burn like a bug under glass.
I am wondering what is interesting to you @Blake about being so self involved? You must just really like fucked up fools. The loster the lovelier? Does it make you feel better inside? Genuinely asking.
I am right now in the position of having to tell someone I am too useless to help them. Having to reneg on something I in my Fe enthusiasm to please said too soon that I would do. Fuck.
I think Blake trying to experience the joys of true self-love hahahaha! You know how sometimes ISFP are terrible and selfish but almost have no shame about that fact? Maybe a bit of that envy.
It is okay to like yourself and not feel deep shames for the narcissism, but I am not sure INFJ can bypass that circuit.
It’s okay… you can… be incompetent at it and fail but try. Sometimes all people want is to see someone put effort and all is forgiven lol. Or actually not try and say you did. ‘-’ /badadvice
Fascinating and desperately needed topic. I have to agree with the baby and self-involved thing, and I think I’ve spent a ton of my life prioritizing protecting it rather than trying to “grow” it (which is what I’m now trying to do).
I do think that if an INFJ really gets out there in the world and keeps throwing themselves at it, they can become fascinating amazing people. Note that this is all from my personal experience…but it turns out that I am mentally flexible and adaptable, not strong but very resilient. And best of all, the incredible self-interest spurs a strong drive towards personal growth and development–after all, I am the most fascinating person to me :).
Now you take that with the “psychic vampire” qualities, and you have someone who can really learn and grow from various relationships by taking on aspects of others that are weak in themselves. I think I’m one of the people with the highest potential for all around personal growth. Also, by being able to attract various types of people and learn from them, it is easy to feel better about yourself if you are willing to get down in the muck with real people and see how their shadow functions control them. I’m never going to be as good as an INFP or INTP can be or be as wonderfully useful as an ISTPs or as stable as an INTJ, but I just have to hang around some ESTPs to feel good about myself or look at how controlling and limiting INFPs and INTPs can be to realize it isn’t all bad to be me.
My guess is Prax or any INTJ’s frustration with INFJs is their inability or refusal to admit that there is a baby in there and deal with it. Instead we cling to an ivory tower to protect and hide the baby which can cause serious flaws in relationships. While I do agree that an INFJ needs to at least have some acknowledgement of the baby’s flaws, at the same time, it really does need some protection and even respect. Protecting that “baby” to a certain extent allows peace and freedom for the mind to function holistically and artistically.
Oh, and my greatest fear is never finding “true love” or a soulmate connection that can satisfy me.
Fi id is just so poignantly human. It is moving. Touching. Beautiful.